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Debt Validation Question -- Federal Rules of Civil Procedure

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Federal Rules of Civil Procedure (FRCP)

FRCP - Rule 1002. Requirement of Original
To prove the content of a writing, recording, or photograph, the original writing, record, or photograph, is required, except as otherwise provided in these rules or by Act of Congress.

FRCP - Rule 1003. Admissibility of Duplicates
A duplicate is admissible to the same extent as an original unless (1) a genuine question is raised as to the authenticity of the original or (2) in this circumstance it would be unfair to admit the duplicate in lieu of the original.

I'm brand spanking new to all of this and am just trying to get up to speed on a variety of things as quickly as I can. I found this site from posts on validation and related to the Sample Letters provided here (good stuff!).

I found the above while searching and wonder if anyone has come across this, and if so, have you used it successfully or not. I know that this is related to Federal procedures, but I've been told that it would be likely that all states would have in place something that would mirror this. The bottom line is that from what I can see, it seems to suggest that as part of a validation request that you'd have the right to demand a copy of originally signed documents -- which I would think would be the initial credit application.


Under 809 ( a ) of the fdcpa act, a debt validation should contain the following items. You can check the FTC website for this purpose. Point 39 is giving the information contained in debt validation.
  • The amount of the debt.

  • The name of the creditor to whom the debt is owed.

  • There should be a statement that if the consumer does not dispute within 30 days, the validation will be treated as valid by the collection agency

  • A statement that if the debt is disputed, it will be verified by the collection agency

  • A statement that if the name and address of the current creditor is different from the original creditor, it will be provided by the collection agency.

  • All the calculation should be shown of the amount that is owed.

  • Provide a verification or copy of any judgment if applicable

  • The Statute of Limitation needs to be proven for the collection of the debt.

  • The license of the collection agency applicable in the state

  • Proof of the agreement that the debt collector has purchased the debt or has been hired by the creditor to collect the debt from the debtor as this is the basic contract law.

As per the federal laws, you can demand to view the original contract if you doubt its authenticity and assume that is has been tampered.


Sub: #1 posted on Fri, 11/04/2005 - 00:17

roxette roxette

(Posts: 4009 | Credits: 559.9)

As per the federal laws, you can demand to view the original contract if you doubt its authenticity and assume that is has been tampered.

Thanks Roxette for the sanity check. I would presume that there is no particular evidentiary requirement to making a demand to do that (meaning you wouldn't have to say the reason, just that you have the right). I've learned that in Virginia (where I am) that there are very few state consumer protection laws, so this to me falls more under the line of things to slow the process down so that I can figure out where I am.

I have a related fdcpa question and if you don't mind since it was my thread and the topic is related...this is referring to this sample letter on the site:

Letter to the debt collecting agency asking them to stop contacting you
Your name
Your street address
Your city


RE: Account no.

Dear Sir/Madam,

This is to request you to CEASE and DESIST from your efforts of collecting debt payments on the above referred account. I would like to work with the original creditor of the account rather than collection agencies.

You are hereby instructed in accordance with the federal and state laws, to stop all collection efforts immediately or face legal sanctions.



Your Signature
Your Name

I know that I had seen something posted somewhere (really need to start bookmarking more I guess) that someone indicated that the FDCPA gives a debtor the "right" to make the above statement -- about working with the original creditor. But I haven't been able to actually find anything on that in the language of the FDCPA. So now that I've stumbled upon the above letter here, with pretty much the same language...well, it seems that it must be based on something. Any clue where this comes from? (the "right" not the letter :roll: )


Sub: #2 posted on Fri, 11/04/2005 - 00:34


That guest reply was me...looks like something ate my cookie and I didn't notice that I wasn't logged in.

Sub: #3 posted on Fri, 11/04/2005 - 00:36

learningfast learningfast

(Posts: 4 | Credits: 18.67)

When a creditor fails to collect the debt from the consumer, it is either passed to their internal collection agency or sold to an outside CA.

This letter states the importance of dealing with the original creditors when an internal collection agency has been assigned to collect the debt from people.

If a debt is sold to outside agency, the creditors can no longer receive payments from you since the account has already been sold off. On such grounds, you will have to make arrangements with the CA only.

But you can choose to work with your creditors, if your debt is within the internal agency.

Hope this answers your query.


Sub: #4 posted on Fri, 11/04/2005 - 01:05

roxette roxette

(Posts: 4009 | Credits: 559.9)

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